I just explained you poor child. You are not a Christian, ergo you cannot understand the teachings of Christianity. You can talk about Islam this and Koran that but unless you're an actual Muslim in lifestyle you cannot understand everything about that doctrine. You can read every book in the Bible but unless you experience that lifestyle then all you know is on the surface. Better? Or are you still not able to understand the words I use to communicate with you?
l AM GOD
- Thread starter Kaze Araki
- Start date
I just explained you poor child. You are not a Christian, ergo you cannot understand the teachings of Christianity. You can talk about Islam this and Koran that but unless you're an actual Muslim in lifestyle you cannot understand everything about that doctrine. You can read every book in the Bible but unless you experience that lifestyle then all you know is on the surface. Better? Or are you still not able to understand the words I use to communicate with you?
If I tell you do you think you can understand?
The soul is the essence of Himself that God placed in Man. When God created us in His own image He wasn't referring solely to our physical appearance but the essence He created in us, i.e., our soul. Our soul is the only part of us that lives forever. Our soul exists on a higher plane and is placed inside of the flesh. In a way we exist before we are even born but of course, we are not actually "living" in a worldly sense until we are conceived. Our soul is our intellect, our thoughts, our emotions.
While the heart and brain are the "physical" receptors and communicators for our soul in a way, in essence the soul is the totality of "us." If your body rots, if your heart dies, if your brain dies "you" will still exist. Of course, not on the physical plane.
The soul is the essence of Himself that God placed in Man. When God created us in His own image He wasn't referring solely to our physical appearance but the essence He created in us, i.e., our soul. Our soul is the only part of us that lives forever. Our soul exists on a higher plane and is placed inside of the flesh. In a way we exist before we are even born but of course, we are not actually "living" in a worldly sense until we are conceived. Our soul is our intellect, our thoughts, our emotions.
While the heart and brain are the "physical" receptors and communicators for our soul in a way, in essence the soul is the totality of "us." If your body rots, if your heart dies, if your brain dies "you" will still exist. Of course, not on the physical plane.
Noted.
Nani? :confused2:
Given that I'm the only person who reads my Bible something like this is quite easy for me to explain. The only issue is whether or not someone like you can understand it.
5 For the living know that they will die,
but the dead know nothing;
they have no further reward,
and even their name is forgotten.
6 Their love, their hate
and their jealousy have long since vanished;
never again will they have a part
in anything that happens under the sun.
All people know at some point that they will die. We were told since Original Sin that because of what Adam did our flesh would not remain forever. From dust we were born and to dust we shall return. Someone of your understand won't know the significance of this next part but try to pay attention. The passage speaks of both physical death and spiritual death. People who die on the spiritual level have no reward, their names are forgoteen, and they will have nothing. Of course that doesn't mean that people who are spiritually dead don't have a soul. It means that compared to the people who are spiritually alive but physically dead, they have nothing. We are all going to die, that much is true. Even people who are spiritually alive will physically die. But spiritual death is not something they will need to worry about. Such is the reason that the passage you quoted speaks of a universal death, yet separates the nature of death betwee the living (i.e. spiritually alive) and the dead (i.e., spiritually dead). Death is guaranteed for us all but what comes afterwards depends upon whether we are spiritually alive in the Word or spiritually dead in the world.
I cannot make this easier for you to understand my friend, I just can't.
I will join Kaze in requesting scriptural evidence. Biblical proof on the existence of these 2 distinct "deaths" please.
[MENTION=45]Kaze Araki[/MENTION]: go right ahead. I'm interested in all viewpoints. And I know I don't follow mainstream Christianity because i believe it's doctrines are unfounded.
[MENTION=45]Kaze Araki[/MENTION]: go right ahead. I'm interested in all viewpoints. And I know I don't follow mainstream Christianity because i believe it's doctrines are unfounded.
I know you're not a fan of research so great news. It's all done for you!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiritual_death_in_Christianity
In Christian theology, spiritual death is separation from God. Humans are separated from God because of sin, which entered the world through the Fall of Man, and are reconciled to God through the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ.[1]
Spiritual death is related to but distinct from physical death and the second (eternal) death. According to the doctrine of original sin, all people are born with a sinful nature and thereby spiritually dead, being separated from God. Christians believe that because Christ defeated sin and death, those who have faith in him are made spiritually alive. Physical death is the separation of the soul from the body. For the Christian, physical death means the beginning of eternal life in the presence of God but for the unbeliever, eternal death and suffering.[2] Saint Gregory Palamas wrote very eloquently on the subject of spiritual death.[3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiritual_death_in_Christianity
In Christian theology, spiritual death is separation from God. Humans are separated from God because of sin, which entered the world through the Fall of Man, and are reconciled to God through the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ.[1]
Spiritual death is related to but distinct from physical death and the second (eternal) death. According to the doctrine of original sin, all people are born with a sinful nature and thereby spiritually dead, being separated from God. Christians believe that because Christ defeated sin and death, those who have faith in him are made spiritually alive. Physical death is the separation of the soul from the body. For the Christian, physical death means the beginning of eternal life in the presence of God but for the unbeliever, eternal death and suffering.[2] Saint Gregory Palamas wrote very eloquently on the subject of spiritual death.[3][4][5][6][7][8][9][10]
Omg Kaze get a screen shot of this. Isn't Noex always the one citing Wikipedia in his arguments? But when someone else does it, now it's a problem. Noex you are ridiculous. Ignore Wikipedia and NOTE, if you possess the capacity to do so, the BIBLICAL citations.
- St Gregory Palamas writes: "You must know, then, reverend mother - or rather, let the maidens who have chosen to live a godly life learn through you - that there is a death of the soul, though by nature the soul is immortal. This is made clear by the beloved disciple, St John the Theologian, when he says, 'There is sin that leads to death' and 'There is sin that does not lead to death' (1 John 5:16, 17). By death he certainly means here the death of the soul. And St Paul says, 'Worldly sorrowfulness produces death' (2 Cor. 7:10) - death, certainly, of the soul. Again, St Paul says, 'Awake, you who sleep, and arise from the dead, and Christ will give you light' (Eph. 5:14). From which 'dead' is one enjoined to arise? Clearly, from those who have been killed by 'sinful desires that wage war against the soul' (1 Pet. 2:11). Hence the Lord also described those who live in this vain world as 'dead', for when one of His disciples asked to be allowed to go and bury his father, He refused permission, and told him to follow Him, leaving the dead to bury their dead (cf. Matt. 8 : 22). Here, then, the Lord clearly calls those living people 'dead', in the sense that they are dead in soul." -- "St Gregory Palamas: To the Most Reverend Nun Xenia: PHILOKALIA VOL IV: Text #8
- ^ "As the separation of the soul from the body is the death of the body, so the separation of God from the soul is the death of the soul. And this death of the soul is the true death. This is made clear by the commandment given in paradise, when God said to Adam, 'On whatever day you eat from the forbidden tree you will certainly die' (cf. Gen. 2:17). And it was indeed Adam's soul that died by becoming through his transgression separated from God; for bodily he continued to live after that time, even for nine hundred and thirty years (cf. Gen. 5:5)."
- <LI id=cite_note-4>^ "St Gregory Palamas: To the Most Reverend Nun Xenia: PHILOKALIA VOL IV: Text #9" <LI id=cite_note-5>^ "The death, however, that befell the soul because of the transgression not only crippled the soul and made man accursed; it also rendered the body itself subject to fatigue, suffering and corruptibility, and finally handed it over to death. For it was after the dying of his inner self brought about by the transgression that the earthly Adam heard the words, 'Earth will be cursed because of what you do, it will produce thorns and thistles for you; through the sweat of your brow you will eat your bread until you return to the earth from which you were taken: for you are earth, and to earth you will return' (Gen. 3:17-19)."
- ^ "St Gregory Palamas: To the Most Reverend Nun Xenia: PHILOKALIA VOL IV: Text #10"
- ^ "Even though at the regeneration to come, in the resurrection of the righteous, the bodies of the godless and sinners will also be raised up, yet they will be given over to the second death, age-long chastisement, the unsleeping worm (cf. Mark 9:44), the gnashing of teeth, the outer, tangible darkness (cf. Matt. 8:12), the murky and unquenchable fire of Gehenna (cf. Matt. 5:22), in which, as the prophet says, the godless and sinners 'will be burned up together and there will be none to quench the flame' (Isa. 1:31). For this is the second death, as St John has taught us in the Revelation (cf. Rev. 20:14). Hark, too, to the words of St Paul, 'If you live in accordance with your fallen self, you will die, but if through the Spirit you extirpate the evil actions of your fallen self, you will live' (Rom. 8:13). Here he speaks of life and death in the age to be: life is the enjoyment of the everlasting kingdom, death agelong chastisement." --- "St Gregory Palamas: To the Most Reverend Nun Xenia: PHILOKALIA VOL IV: Text #11"
- ^ "Thus the violation of God's commandment is the cause of all types of death, both of soul and body, whether in the present life or in that endless chastisement. And death, properly speaking, is this: for the soul to be unharnessed from divine grace and to be yoked to sin. This death, for those who have their wits, is truly dreadful and something to be avoided. This, for those who think aright, is more terrible than the chastisement of Gehenna. From this let us also flee with all our might. Let us cast away, let us reject all things, bid farewell to all things: to all relationships, actions and intentions that drag us downward, separate us from God and produce such a death. He who is frightened of this death and has preserved himself from it will not be alarmed by the oncoming death of the body, for in him the true life dwells, and bodily death, so far from taking true life away, renders it inalienable." --- "St Gregory Palamas: To the Most Reverend Nun Xenia: PHILOKALIA VOL IV: Text #12"
- ^ As the death of the soul is authentic death, so the life of the soul is authentic life. Life of the soul is union with God, as life of the body is its union with the soul. As the soul was separated from God and died in consequence of the violation of the commandment, so by obedience to the commandment it is again united to God and is quickened. This is why the Lord says in the Gospels, 'The words I speak to you are spirit and life' (John 6:63). And having experienced the truth of this, St Peter said to Him, 'Thy words are the words of eternal life' (John 6:68). But they are words of eternal life for those who obey them; for those who disobey, this commandment of life results in death (cf. Rom. 7:10). So it was that the apostles, being Christ's fragrance, were to some the death-inducing odor of death, while to others they were the life-inducing odor of life (cf. 2 Cor. 2:16)." -- "St Gregory Palamas: To the Most Reverend Nun Xenia: PHILOKALIA VOL IV: Text #13"
[MENTION=170]Zero Phoenix[/MENTION]
Before you shoot me, I need to clarify once again that the view point I presented is from [secular] historical perspective.
[MENTION=164]noex1337[/MENTION]
First of all, the Bible was written and redacted by various authors in various times and with various theological viewpoints. Lumping them together will of course create conflicting accounts such is what we see right now.
Initially, there is no such thing as "soul" in Judaism.
When you're dead, you're dead (see Genesis account for this).
Later, a new interpretation comes in where there exist a sort of shady sentient existence in the underworld (Sheol) (see Samuel account for this).
Finally, Greek (Hellenistic) influence introduce to Judaism (and later Christianity) the idea of heaven, hell and fully immortal sentient soul (see New Testament account for this).
Before you shoot me, I need to clarify once again that the view point I presented is from [secular] historical perspective.
[MENTION=164]noex1337[/MENTION]
First of all, the Bible was written and redacted by various authors in various times and with various theological viewpoints. Lumping them together will of course create conflicting accounts such is what we see right now.
Initially, there is no such thing as "soul" in Judaism.
When you're dead, you're dead (see Genesis account for this).
Later, a new interpretation comes in where there exist a sort of shady sentient existence in the underworld (Sheol) (see Samuel account for this).
Finally, Greek (Hellenistic) influence introduce to Judaism (and later Christianity) the idea of heaven, hell and fully immortal sentient soul (see New Testament account for this).
I'm not going to attack you Kaze-dono. Relax. :badass:
I just wonder why Noex asks me a question, I answer it, he is proved wrong and then he jumps ship. He then asks for proof of my position, I give it to him, but he discounts Wikipedia despite the fact he uses it all the time. Finally, I give him citations and rather than be a true scholar and do some research, he's going to sit his ass in front of the computer, not do any fact checking, and somehow believe he is correct. This is turning into a bad comedy.
Well whatever, Kaze-dono, Noex, we good.
H U
I'm out!
I just wonder why Noex asks me a question, I answer it, he is proved wrong and then he jumps ship. He then asks for proof of my position, I give it to him, but he discounts Wikipedia despite the fact he uses it all the time. Finally, I give him citations and rather than be a true scholar and do some research, he's going to sit his ass in front of the computer, not do any fact checking, and somehow believe he is correct. This is turning into a bad comedy.
Well whatever, Kaze-dono, Noex, we good.
H U
I'm out!
I agree with this completely. While I do believe the bible, i think Christianity has been severely tainted by paganistic practices and theology. I do not accept the divinity of the pope, neither do I necessarily care what he has to say. I refuse to accept any human who attempts to claim any divinity over me.
[MENTION=170]Zero Phoenix[/MENTION]: Before i start explaining it to you, mind reformatting that or at least extracting the bible texts? The formatting is atrocious.
[MENTION=170]Zero Phoenix[/MENTION]: Before i start explaining it to you, mind reformatting that or at least extracting the bible texts? The formatting is atrocious.
Say whut? The soul is very much real in Judaism.
Gensis 2:7 - And the Almighty formed the man of dust from the ground, and he blew into his nostrils the soul of life.
King Solomon wrote:
Ecclessiastes 12:17 - The dust will return to the ground as it was, and the spirit will return to the God who gave it.
In judaism the soul is not just real, it's the part of god that is inside you, your reason for living.
Gensis 2:7 - And the Almighty formed the man of dust from the ground, and he blew into his nostrils the soul of life.
King Solomon wrote:
Ecclessiastes 12:17 - The dust will return to the ground as it was, and the spirit will return to the God who gave it.
In judaism the soul is not just real, it's the part of god that is inside you, your reason for living.