Technology and human labor

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#2
If I'm not wrong, the idea of robots doing menial tasks was partially due to the need for the existing workforce to take on more advanced jobs such as those in entrepreneurship, so robots taking over the menial job industry isn't too much of a concern because more jobs requiring skilled labour are appearing.
 

Denuo Prince

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#3
The robots aren't the main point. Just what triggered the idea.

This is the point:

So I want you guys to discuss what you think is more important. Progress with technology or employment.
 
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#4
Well, IMO those two options aren't mutually exclusive. With technological process more jobs related to it (eg. maintenance of technology, technological research) will be created. Sure, more jobs in the blue-collared work sector may be lost due to technology replacing them than the jobs created in the technology sector, but given the exponential growth of technology I think it balances things out.

As for what I personally feel is more important, it would be employment. Employment deals with humans here, and lack of employment may have dire negative circumstances. Though technology is pretty neat and all, losing it wouldn't hurt as much because we didn't have technology in the first place, and technology isn't as relevant to survival as employment is.
 

Kaze Araki

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#5
What very little people recognize as fundamental is actually creating a sustainable economy.
The question of technology against labor is a false dichotomy, as they are merely decided based upon profit and nothing else.
 
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#6
What very little people recognize as fundamental is actually creating a sustainable economy.
The question of technology against labor is a false dichotomy, as they are merely decided based upon profit and nothing else.
So basically your point is that whatever is most important is whatever is more capable of sustaining an economy at that juncture in time? Hmm, interesting. I never thought of it that way. Still, isn't employment a larger factor in economy as compared with technology? Or are there cases of the contrary?

Also, Nameless wanted our personal opinions as well, and I'm interested to find out yours. :*_*:
 

Core

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#7
Agreed the 2 are not mutually exclusive. Unless you work from the premise where a robot = >human and is 100% autonomous in its repairs, evolution and maintenance and cost virtually nothing to create(or just as much as the person would be paid for a lifetime of employment).

Then it is possible to say Yes robots can replace people and their jobs.

but if you accept the fact that robots in their current state can only do very basic very simple menial jobs whilst being fully autonomous, they still require maintenance and upkeep and production. It is highly unlikely that a mexican slave labor force of 100 men or even 5000 will be less costly then a 100% anatomically correct perfect robot capable of doing what a mexican slave labor force can.

Off Topic:


The biggest issue in the world economy is not that there are no jobs. Its that more then 60% of all jobs currently in existence are jobs that exist only because of Planned Obsolesence. Without which no one would buy a new ipod every year and thus limit their production to maybe 1 in 10 years. The market crashed because people stopped spending their money, It is because they lost faith in the system. The system could no longer support jobs that were only in existence because people were spending their money.... and thus the jobs dissappear.
But as the stockmarket will appear to rise again, people will gain faith in the system again, and start living hand-to-mouth again.. and then the need for PO jobs will continue to grow again.

Ah.. the circle of money.
 

Denuo Prince

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#8
What very little people recognize as fundamental is actually creating a sustainable economy.
The question of technology against labor is a false dichotomy, as they are merely decided based upon profit and nothing else.
Well the economy is basically just a market of trade. If people don't have jobs they wont have money to trade with.
 
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#9
The biggest issue in the world economy is not that there are no jobs. Its that more then 60% of all jobs currently in existence are jobs that exist only because of Planned Obsolesence. Without which no one would buy a new ipod every year and thus limit their production to maybe 1 in 10 years. The market crashed because people stopped spending their money, It is because they lost faith in the system. The system could no longer support jobs that were only in existence because people were spending their money.... and thus the jobs dissappear.
But as the stockmarket will appear to rise again, people will gain faith in the system again, and start living hand-to-mouth again.. and then the need for PO jobs will continue to grow again.

Ah.. the circle of money.
I find this thing about Planned Obsolesence extremely intriguing. Pardon my deviation from the original point of contention for a moment, but do you have any sources through which I can read up more on this? ;please;
 

Kaze Araki

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#11
Money is just a piece of paper which holds value because the government says so, a job is merely an extension of this fictional reality.
The question of the correct form of economic model is a philosophical question that ultimately return back to the type of society that we desire.
A sustainable economy is a futuristic economic vision that attempt to replace our current unsustainable system.
 

Core

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#12
I find this thing about Planned Obsolesence extremely intriguing. Pardon my deviation from the original point of contention for a moment, but do you have any sources through which I can read up more on this? ;please;

Too.... Effing.... Many -.-

Lightbulb conspiracy is in HSL somewhere might have to go back a few pages though.

Money is just a piece of paper which holds value because the government says so, a job is merely an extension of this fictional reality.
The question of the correct form of economic model is a philosophical question that ultimately return back to the type of society that we desire.
A sustainable economy is a futuristic economic vision that attempt to replace our current unsustainable system.
go away
 

Denuo Prince

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#13
Money is just a piece of paper which holds value because the government says so, a job is merely an extension of this fictional reality.
The question of the correct form of economic model is a philosophical question that ultimately return back to the type of society that we desire.
A sustainable economy is a futuristic economic vision that attempt to replace our current unsustainable system.
Its financial capital or more specifically 'imaginary' capital. And whether we are talking about recession or growth money is an crucial thing to have and is used in our daily trade.
Everything in the economy is there because the government says so but thats life. Capitalism especially is just a bunch of people exploiting trade for their advantage because the government leads them to believe its worth exploiting.

The government sets the stage and the people do whatever they can to get an advantage.

[MENTION=1543]Core[/MENTION]

I fail see what my post had to do with yours.
 

Core

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#14
Its financial capital or more specifically 'imaginary' capital. And whether we are talking about recession or growth money is an crucial thing to have an dis used in our daily trade.
Everything in the economy is there because the government says so but thats life. Capitalism especially is just a bunch of people exploiting trade for their advantage because the government leads them to believe its worth exploiting.

The government sets the stage and the people do whatever they can to get an advantage.

Seriously?

I tell him to go-away and you pleasure him further and thus just derailed your own topic? :p

For the 121st time... My name is not Crom.
 

Kaze Araki

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#15
It's Core, not Crom.
The latter might find it abusive if you continue to mistaken their names.

Anyway, to answer your question - one need go back to the fundamental first; what is money, and what is the purpose of its creation?
 

Denuo Prince

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#16
Seriously?

I tell him to go-away and you pleasure him further and thus just derailed your own topic? :p
Im not agreeing with him just telling him how economics works. Its based solely on the people exploiting trade driven by their need to gain an advantage.


It's Core, not Crom
The latter might find it abusive if you continue to mistaken their names.

Anyway, to answer your question - one need go back to the fundamental first; what is money, and what is the purpose of its creation?
Well then that would be icing on the cake.
 

Core

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#17
Im not agreeing with him just telling him how economics works. Its based solely on the people exploiting trade driven by their need to gain an advantage.




Well then that would be icing on the cake.

Thats not how economics work. And by latter he means Crom, not Core.

@Hadriel you may aswell stay in this topic it looks like its gonna be another LEX vs COR showdowns of economic debate only this time with KAZ vs PRI
 

Denuo Prince

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#18
[MENTION=1543]Core[/MENTION]

Yes it is. Ever heard of the invisible hand?

When people try to exploit trade to their advantage it leads to the well being of the economy.
 

Core

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#19
Kk thats ONE aspect of a self-sustaining market(or regulating).

Just one tiny aspect.

Can you tell me how the economy, and debt based currency works, and can you cite sources?